How To Deal With Online Tolls

Dave Jackson00:00:00

If you've ever thought I want feedback, but I'm terrified of the Internet, stay tuned. I'm going to show you how to get useful criticism without letting trolls live rent free in your head. Hit it, ladies.

The SOP Ladies00:00:14

The school of podcasting with Dave Jackson.

Dave Jackson00:00:20

Podcasting since 2005. I'm your award winning hall of fame podcast coach. And Dave Jackson, thanking you so much for tuning in.If you're new to the show, this is where I help you plan, launch and grow your podcast. And one of the ways you can grow your podcast is via feedback. And so we're going to be talking about that today.My website, schoolofpodcasting.com use the coupon code listnr when you sign up for either a monthly, quarterly or yearly subscription. So there are two groups of people that can give you feedback. One we call trolls.These are people that you didn't ask for their feedback, but boy, do they love to give it. Now, in some cases, those trolls might actually be fans of your show that just wish you were doing something different.And then there is another type of feedback group called we'll just call it a focus group, meaning they're trying to shape the focus of the show. And so we're going to start off by talking about trolls. The first thing we need to talk about is wait.And what I mean by that is if they, if they get you and they get you riled up, it's really easy to do exactly what they want you to do, which is get mad and respond. So the first thing you want to do is wait before you respond. And there are a couple different ways you can respond, but I'm going to play a clip.I've bleeped out all the naughty bits, but this is from Marc Maron back when he was doing wtf because one of the things that will attract trolls. So if this was something, you know, what's the bait to get fish. Here are those things and you know they're coming. The first one, politics. Yep.A lot of people are gonna come over to tell you how stupid you are. The other one is if you're commenting on news, which often is about, you guessed it, politics or what's just going on in the news.And then the third one, anybody want to guess? Yep. So many people argue about it is religion. Even amongst the same religion, people argue over religion.So if you're worried about trolls, then try to avoid those things.Now, if that's what your show's about, that's fine, but just realize that you're going to have some People probably not like your stuff, and you have to be okay with that. Not everybody's going to like you.

Marc Maron00:03:04

That's why I've taken to doing these Instagram lives some mornings and having coffee with all the strangers and even the trolls that love me.I've decided that if you have a troll that is a repeat customer, they're in love with you and they're just dying for you to get mad at them because that's how they experience love. I think many of them may be master while they're attacking you on Twitter or on Instagram or wherever you. You roll comments. A lot of them are just.It's deep down, it's just a frustrated love. And they just want Daddy to yell at them. They want to make Daddy mad so they know Daddy cares. Trolls.

Dave Jackson00:03:42

And so that's where you'll hear the phrase, don't feed the trolls. And by that meaning, don't let them get you mad. That's what they want. Don't lash out, you know, so this is where I always say, wait, wait.And then the other thing you want to think about here, because, yeah, you could ignore them, but there's also something you might want to do, and that's ask yourself, do they have a point?So let's take an example of you do an interview show and you interview somebody and somebody leaves a comment, or they send you an email or whatever it is, and they say, man, you interrupted that guest left and right. Would you please just let them talk now?It's easy after you edited it for hours to fire back, I put a lot of work into this and blah, blah, blah, blah. Or you could again, wait, go over, listen to the interview and listen to. See, did you interrupt the guest a lot?And if you did, you can reply back then and say, and you always want to kill them with kindness. That is one of the strategies. Always kill them with kindness. If you're going to reply, because rule number one is don't feed the trolls.Just don't do anything.But some people, especially on YouTube, which is probably where you're gonna get more trolls than anything is you, you want to get comments on your video, because of course we have to feed the algorithm. And so one of the ways to do that is to actually interact with the trolls.And so you could kill them with kindness and go, hey, I just went back and listened. You've actually got a point. Thank you so much for the feedback. I'll try to do better in the future. That could be one way. Kill them with kindness.But Step one, do they have a point? Now, there are times when people will give you feedback that really they want you to do a completely different show.I do a live kind of call in chat show every Saturday. Ask the podcast coach if you're looking for free podcast consulting. AskThePodcastCoach.com live every Saturday, 10:30 Eastern.And I had a guy that gave us two and a half pages of notes and they were very detailed. You know, hey, on episode 47 at the 38 and a half minute mark, you did this, you should do that. So he really took time.The problem was he wanted us to do a completely different show. And so it's always, if you don't know what to say, if you're going to engage, you can always just say, thank you so much for the feedback.Even if the feedback is, I wish you would die. Your mother is a whatever, right? Hey, thank you for the feedback. Because again, they want to make you mad. So keep that in mind.You could kill them with kindness no matter what you're doing. Here are a couple other things. If you're going to engage, ask them how you could do it better.Because sometimes they're easy to point out, hey, you did it wrong. And I don't know why the the troll sounds like Sylvester Stallone. You did it wrong. What are you doing? Hey, yo.So, you know, you could say, hey, thank you so much for the feedback. How could I have done this better? Because here's the fun thing, everybody can say, hey, that's wrong. Very few people know how to do it right.They just want to point out that you're wrong. And in some cases, I've had people do this to me. I remember once I was on Reddit and I wasn't trolling, I was just trying to help.And I said, hey, just for the record, Audio outperforms video 15 to 1. And somebody chimed in, hey, where did you get that stat from? And I said, oh, thanks for asking, here's a link.And I gave him the link to a speech by Rob Walsh, who at the time worked for Libsyn and talked about how when Bill Maher put out his video show, we had to talk him in to do an audio. And in the end, the audio op performed video 15 to 1. So you could say, oh, that's an interesting point.Where are you getting like, what are you basing that on? You have to be careful because if you're defensive, then the troll is on. But if you say, thanks so much for that, I'd like to look into this.What is your. You know, just like, hey, don't say hey. You're full of crap. Where'd you get that from? Say, hey, I'm interested in digging into this more.Can you provide a link so I could learn more is better than, you know. What are you basing this on?Now, another thing you could do, and this one again, through all this, you have to be professional and calm, is you could say, hey, thanks so much for the feedback, and do the opposite. Here's where I'm basing my opinion on link to this. You'll see where it says blankety blank, blank, blank. And so you're educating them.Now, if it's a true troll who just wants to be negative and cry and moan, they're probably not going to do anything with that. But that is an option. Another one you can do is respectfully stand your ground.I watched the TED Talk about trolls, and it was a meteorologist, a female meteorologist, and some trolls said, you should burn that dress. And she replied, I love this dress too much to burn it. To which the actual troll said, oh, man, I'm so sorry. I didn't think anybody read these.And that again, sometimes people are just participating in the new national pastime of America. No, not baseball, apple pie or Chevrolet. It's recreational outrage, man.

Dave Jackson00:09:51

And.

Dave Jackson00:09:51

And so they're just partaking of that. So you could stand your ground and just go, oh, you know, no, thank you, but I'm doing this.And I've learned this from different times when I've been speaking and things like that. Is realize some people may be having a bad day right now. I am the head of podcasting at PodPage.Before that, I worked for Libsyn, and there are times when people are just having a bad day and you happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. And I had a guy about a month ago that complained about. He's like, well, I have to send this in. I have to wait forever to get an answer.Which was really weird because I love when people do this. They get two tickets going, so you're answering the same question twice for whatever. And I literally.He waited, and I'm going to say less than a minute to get an answer. And then he replied before my reply had gotten to him or he hadn't looked at it.

Dave Jackson00:10:48

And.

Dave Jackson00:10:48

And I replied to that one. So this guy had gotten two replies in under five minutes, and yet he was complaining about how long it was taking to get a reply.And when I fixed his thing, he said, I'm really sorry about the response. I'm just having a bad day. So keep in mind one of the reasons why you may not want to poke the troll is maybe they're just having a bad day.Now, another thing you can do is in some cases, if you have a, you know, Facebook group, a heartbeat, a circle group, school, whatever it is, and somebody is trolling you on your website or in Reddit or something like that, this is where you can round up the troops and say, hey, this guy over here just said, I don't know what I'm talking about, in case you care, and then just let your. Your army go. Not so much attack him or her, but just explain, you know, that, hey, you do know what you're talking about.Now if things get really bad, I had a guy, it was so funny, that would lose his absolute love and mind if I had a typo.Now, I am much better than I used to be, but still occasionally, fat finger stuff, and I spell check and all that stuff, you know, something gets through. And when I would do this, this guy would just lose his mind and he would email me about five or six paragraphs.How are you calling yourself an expert when you misspelled the word blah, blah, blah? I can't believe. Yada, yada, yada. I remember at one point he started getting really personal, you know, calling me stupid and blah, blah, blah, and.And that's when I was like, hey, you can bash my work all you want, but you've kind of crossed the line. Please don't be a weenie. And he emailed me back and said, that's it, I'm done.I'm never listening to another episode, yada, yada yada, which of course, the next episode, he had something to say. I forget what it was. I don't think I had a typo. But he was in. This is where I was using WordPress.And this is where people go, I wish I could have comments on my website. Do you? I'd rather much rather get a voicemail or an email, because bots can be used to leave comments. So keep that in mind. And he left a comment.And I said, hey, like, I thought you weren't going to listen anymore. And so I was kind of trolling the troll. And that started a whole nother thing.And he then swore up and down, I will never listen to any of your content ever again. And I did not hear from this person for quite a while, probably six months.And I then started posting things on YouTube to which he then showed up and I Was like, oh, I've missed you so much. So again, kill them with kindness. And I think that made him mad and he went away. But just realize many trolls are just trying to get you upset.That's a true troll. Some of them are trying to give you feedback that should be appreciated.Realize that this is really where knowing your why and knowing your who, this is why that's so important. Because, you know, like the guy that I do a live and I'm putting up air quotes here, call in show. It's like a.It's more of a chat show, but we're answering questions live, me and Jim Collison. And his feedback was, you should bring on guests and ask questions. Well, that's great feedback. That's just not the show we want to do.So always look to see do they have a point. And if they're just trolling you, again, do not feed the troll. That's probably the best thing. But if you are always kill them with kindness.You could ask them, hey, how can I do it better? That really, in some cases throws people for a loop because they're expecting you to just come back and call them names and stuff.You could ask them for evidence. Again, this is always done in a professional way. You could try to educate them. Although some people, you can lead them to water. Keep that in mind.You could respectfully stand your ground. Realize that doesn't go over very well in some cases.And then the last thing is, if somebody really gets nasty on YouTube, you can block them and you can report them. So keep that in mind. That's the. Now, some people just don't have time for any nonsense. And if it's on YouTube, they just block and report everything.Well, that's one way. If you get super popular, you can take the stance of just not reading the comments. You basically put out the stuff.And then I know some people that will have their spouse pass along only the positive comments and they will ignore the negative trolling comments. But if you're worried about people judging you and leaving negative comments, let's just start with the first thing. I don't want to be judged.Well, I went out today and let's see, where did I go? I think I was in Home Depot. And I'm sure the person behind me waiting in line was probably thinking, man, that guy's legs are white.What is he allergic to the sun? To which I would say, as a matter of fact, I am.But, you know, or you're standing in grocery line, you're like, wait, why do they need nine boxes of Pop Tarts. What the. You know you're always being judged, so start there and you're okay, you're fine.The only thing is, now when people feel Anonymous, they feel 10ft tall and bulletproof. They're going to share their comments.And if they're really mean and nasty and they really hate your show, there is a name for that and that's called not your target audience. So most of the time, I personally will just go, thank you for the feedback.That way I can feed the algorithm because almost all negative comments are on Facebook. But before we wrap up, let me read you some of my faves. Here's one. Three stars. I don't know, man. I'm here for the excellent advice and information.You lost me at RFK junior. It's your show that was a turn off. And I think all I was mentioning is that guy has a not so typical voice.But, you know, here again, I skid it up against something political and I got a three star review. Ah, the coveted one star review. You're not a real podcaster until you get a one star review. This was from Violet from four years ago.This show puts in the latest. Oh, I'm sorry. See, I can't even read it. This show puts in the least amount of energy necessary.Recycled sketchy opinions and sketchy advice and sketchy services dripping with dude caster energy. This show doesn't know what it doesn't know and doesn't care and make sure audience knows it. This is one of my favorites.Almost all negative comments have bad grammar as some kind of postured brag. Podcasting needs to do better than this.So this show doesn't know what it doesn't know and doesn't care and make sure audience knows it as some kind of postured brag. I don't know. Whatever. That's a one star review. And of course I'm looking at Apple. I'm only seeing the US reviews.That's another thing that Pod Gagement can do. Also, if you're an elite member of podpage, that'll do that. I just looked. I had five.Three star or less out of 350 reviews at least in Apple podcasts that I'm looking at. Again, I'm probably ignoring some countries, which is like 1.5%.So if you're not podcasting because you're worried about bad reviews, 1.5% of a bunch of trolls that probably aren't your key demographic that you're trying to reach is stopping you, which is a Bummer. Because that means there's 98% of people that could really love to hear your show.I've got some people that have put together some focus groups and they're going to explain how to do it right after this.

The SOP Ladies00:19:47

Yeah, yeah, yeah. The school of podcasting. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dave Jackson00:22:06

One of the things I love about the different places I've worked is I always get to run into different people. And so being the head of podcasting at PodPage, I ran across Madam Strangeways. If you've never heard of her, here she is describing her show.

Madame Strangeways00:22:23

Here's my intro. Welcome to Madame Strangeways, where I, Madam Strangeways, narrate your true strange stories of the unexplained. But it's not just that.I'm not just telling people's true paranormal experiences.I'm also going down a slew of strange rabbit holes along the way, because I can't help but go down research rabbit holes when I'm looking up the backgrounds of these stories or what might cause it. You know, especially if you're a skeptic, I've got skeptical views. And if you're a believer, I've got some paranormal or folkloric views.So hopefully I've got a little something for anybody. And who doesn't love something spooky? I'll year long too. It's not just Halloween, spooky all year long.That's how we do things at the Madam Strangeways household.

Dave Jackson00:23:04

And of course, where can you find all that stuff?

Madame Strangeways00:23:06

Madamstrangeways.com hosted by PodPage.

Dave Jackson00:23:10

And you may not know this, if you're an Elite member at PodPage, you can do one on one consulting with me. And so we were on a call and she explained how she just wasn't interested in getting any feedback.Now realize myself when God was handing out logic, I went back for seconds. So that doesn't make any sense to me that you wouldn't want feedback for your show. And so I asked her why.

Madame Strangeways00:23:37

Okay, so obviously, look, I understand my logical science brain, that feedback is really important, but I personally have been really reluctant to put myself out there for feedback on the Internet because, And it was 20 years ago now, a cyber bullying situation that happened with a bunch of men on the Internet. And that was 20 years ago and the Internet is so much worse now than it is than it was back then. So I'm even more reluctant now to.

Dave Jackson00:24:10

Put myself out there and I totally understand that. I had some negative feedback on my singing voice when I was younger and that stopped me from trying to do any kind of lead vocals.And then when I did, somebody said, would you please sing at my wedding? And I was like, wait, what? I have a bad voice? And they go, no, you don't. So, again, don't let that one person stop you.But one of the things you can do to get good feedback, or shall we say constructive feedback, is to find somebody who will give you honest feedback. And even that she was a little worried about it.

Madame Strangeways00:24:47

We've got nine patrons right now, so. The Nightmarish nine, I think. Yeah, Yeah, I think you're right. I mean, I think that's a great idea to ask them.But here's the thing is, the voice in my head goes, yeah, but, like, if they like me, then, like, their feedback is going to be good. And, you know, I. Technically, I want to get objective feedback, but then that's also scary.

Dave Jackson00:25:11

So let's take it outside of podcasting and put it into food.If you put too much salt in your loaf of bread and these people know, hey, this is the bread I'm gonna be feeding you from now until forever, they're much more likely to go, hey, I'm not trying to hurt your feelings or anything like that, but that's a little too salty. And you'd be like, oh, I didn't realize. Okay, thanks. So it's.Again, I understand we all don't want negative feedback, but it might be as simple as, hey, you're cutting off the interviewer and you didn't realize you were doing it. So many times we do things that we don't realize we're doing it, and we have to be okay that we're not perfect, because I don't know, we're not.

Madame Strangeways00:25:57

Yeah.You know, if you've got several episodes in the can and then you find out that something you've done in those episodes is really not resonating with your listeners, oh, what do you do?

Dave Jackson00:26:08

And so when I threw out the idea of, hey, maybe ask your patrons, because these are obviously fans of yours.I know my buddy Glenn Hebert over at Horse Radio Network has a huge patreon, and he said they are not shy at all, because, again, you explain how your feedback is going to make the show better for them. I also spoke with JR Sparrow, because that's what he recommends when it comes to growing your show.Here's J.R. talking about his show, WVU Uncommon Place.

JR Sparrow00:26:44

It's a show where I cover society, culture, and on the cheap end, I cover four events in West Virginia every year to let enlighten People about the life of West Virginians. And I do cover other things there. And then the Bread and Butter Show. Sperry's Under Review. Sperry Is Under Review is a show with me and my wife.We review movies and we review restaurants. We review everything. We're assessors. We're not even reviewers anymore.And on that show, we cover a gamut of things and we let you know what it's like to live in Appalachia, watch a movie on a projector at nighttime, no matter the weather outside.

Dave Jackson00:27:18

And you can find everybody's show out@schoolofpodcasting.com 1044. But I asked JR how did he go about building his focus group?

JR Sparrow00:27:27

I had to really do a real call to action. I did it on the podcast. I said, hey, anybody that likes a show, let me get some feedback. And I gave them options on how to reach me.I did the email, nobody bit. I did Instagram, nobody cared. I did LinkedIn, no one cared. And then obviously I went to Snapchat.And Snapchat, for anyone that doesn't know, is a geolocation based app.

Dave Jackson00:27:54

And what JR uses is a thing called a Snap Map.

JR Sparrow00:27:59

I can put it in any location I want and it's going to stay there for two years and anybody that's on that Snap map can find it. So I went to the Snap Map and I said, hey, Snapchat people, what do you think of this episode?And I had 100 people come back and they said, hey, this show was crap. We wouldn't listen to this. And they were 100% honest.And the first 10 people that did that about eight years ago, I've kept those two people in line on both of my shows.

Dave Jackson00:28:29

Now you might be thinking, oh, if somebody came back to me and said, wow, this is crap, I couldn't take it. Okay, but that just means for the next two years, you're going to be marketing a show that's not resonating with your audience.So can you take a little bit of constructive feedback or do you just have an infinite amount of time and. And you don't care how much you waste?

JR Sparrow00:28:53

They actually helped me curate the four shows for the month and tie them into the next month. It's almost like, and they're not getting paid or anything, they're actually just getting to listen early. And I don't get a download from them later.But they actually help me scope, like, what makes sense and what doesn't make sense. So that's why I really reached out to these people. And then From Snapchat, obviously. I did what everyone should do. I got the email addresses and.And I got them aligned with me, and I found out more about them.

Dave Jackson00:29:23

And the more you know about your audience, the better the content you can create. JR had a great phrase about moving forward without feedback.

JR Sparrow00:29:33

In podcasting, I don't care what level you are, there are no participation trophies. If you're doing it as a hobby, you can have a trophy.If you're doing it for any reason, that is going to put a dollar sign behind it at a point, there's no participation trophy. And you have to have skin like Shrek. You have to be an ogre or a onion.And a lot of podcasters get into this and think they're going to be millionaires on the first day. They think 100 episodes in, they're going to be the next sliced bread, and they're not.

Dave Jackson00:30:02

And if you really want some good feedback, you have to do a lot of planning. And so you'll hear where JR is working months in advance.

JR Sparrow00:30:11

We'll just do an example, Male Mental Health Month, right? I'll send that out three or four months ahead of time and be like, hey, do you think this guest aligns?And then, you know, talking to a specific guest, you know, or the listener, it could be male, female. I'm asking them the perspective. I'm like, hey, your husband, would you, like, listen to this in a car with him?You know, I'll give him a little questionnaire on what I'm trying to get out of the episode. If I were a listener. And they'll just flat out say no. Yes. Or give an explanation or just say no. And when I get a cold, no.I know the people because we've been together so long that I'm like, hey, they said no like, three times in a row. This episode's canned.

Dave Jackson00:30:49

And I've never. I don't think I even have a Snapchat account.When it first came online, you would post a picture and it would get erased, or a lot of people were using it for naughty, naughty purposes. But listen to this story, and I've definitely got to look into Snap maps. I'll see if I can't find a video on YouTube or something.Of course, you could always reach out to JR and that, again, you can find out@schoolofpodcasting.com 1044. But check this out.

JR Sparrow00:31:15

The WWE Royal Rumble Wrestling event was going on that year in St. Petersburg or something. Well, I had some podcasters that were wrestling fans to do a show with me and Stacy once. Barry's under review, and so he was.

Dave Jackson00:31:27

In town for Pod Fest, and, well, this happened, and I put the show.

JR Sparrow00:31:31

There and got a thousand downloads.

Dave Jackson00:31:33

And so keep in mind, as we talk about feedback, at the heart of every podcaster, there is a need to serve their audience. Every great podcaster I've spoken with, they want to serve their audience.And when your need to serve the audience is greater than your fear of trolls, of your fear of looking silly, or your fear of feedback, don't fear the feedback. That sounds like a great song, doesn't it? Don't fear the feedback because it's the feedback.My buddy Randall Black says feedback is the breakfast of champions. You should be looking for feedback because why don't you want to make it better? If we look at Mr.Beast, when he started as a young, young kid, his goal of every episode was just to be a little better than the previous one. Well, how do you make it better? By listening to it and getting feedback. Because you can't fix what you don't know is broken.So you, my friend, have done hard things. You know, you have think about the hardest thing you've ever done, and now think about somebody going, you interrupt your guest too much.It's nothing compared to the things that you have done. So you can do hard things and you can do this. And again, for me, it was, what, 1.5% are negative reviews? So what? So what?You could help 98% of the people that hear your show. So please don't let your podcast idea stay in your head.Please don't let your podcast that you recorded live on your hard drive, it's not helping anyone there. You have to put it out there.Now, one of the things, and this is where you're going to go, this whole thing was a pitch, but we do offer listener parties at the school of podcasting. If you're looking for a safe place, we will give you the praise and we will kind of go, hey, you lost me.And don't you want to know if you lost your audience so you can fix it? You want to get feedback before you launch.And if you can do things like JR's doing and like Glenn are doing, in some cases, they're getting the feedback before they publish it, because then when it goes to everyone, you're putting out the best content you can make. And I know you might be sitting there thinking, oh, but I just. I just. I'm too worried. Look, you've.You've received feedback in the past, and you're still here. You can do this. Come on. I'm telling you, you can do this. It's going to be okay. And I can help.

The SOP Ladies00:34:25

Yeah, yeah, yeah. The school of podcasting. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dave Jackson00:35:54

I keep forgetting to mention this in newsletters and stuff. I am up for being a speaker at Podcast Movement, and they're doing something different now. Here's the thing.When we talk about putting ourselves out there right now, I'm saying, hey, I've got three talks that you can vote for at Podcast Movement. One is six ways to measure your success that aren't downloads. We just talked about that. We got six reasons.Apparently, I was hung up on the number six. Six reasons your show isn't growing. Quit shooting yourself in the foot that currently has one vote and quit guessing why your show isn't growing.Ask your audience that has three votes, and those are all mine. And I will put links to all of these, and if you could vote for them, I would love to speak at Podcast Movement.Now realize that if people don't, I'm asking for feedback. I'm asking for a call to action. And I might lose because there are a lot of really good speakers up and we'll see what happens.But this is a risk, right? My ego might get bruised. Oh, heavens to Murgatroyd, to quote the Great Snagglepuss.And so sometimes you put yourself out there and you might get your finger smacked. But I'm willing to do it. Why? Because I really love to talk in public.If you didn't know, I'm a former teacher, and to me, Podcast Movement is a big classroom, and I love getting back on stage and making people laugh as they learn. So I'll put links to that out again@schoolofpodcasting.com 1045.And if you know anybody that would like to vote, please share that, because, silly me, I keep forgetting to mention this on all my shows.

The SOP Ladies00:37:45

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dave Jackson00:37:47

Speaking of feedback, since we are rounding third here, never ask people at the end of your show how long your show should be, because anybody who thinks your show is too long is already gone. And yes, please don't ask me how I know. That's something I did many, many, many moons ago.But feedback should be always welcome, always encouraged, and make it easy for me.Schoolofpodcasting.com contact will take you right to a form schoolofpodcasting.com voicemail he said, thinking in his head, don't give too many calls to action. You know, slash voicemail. Notice that both those, though, use my URL. So I'm reinforcing my brand. Always embrace feedback now.If you need help with your show, you know where to find me.SchoolOfPodcasting.com, use that coupon Code Listener when you sign up for either a monthly, quarterly or yearly subscription and it comes worrying free with a 30 day money back guarantee. If you have any questions, please reach out. Thank you so much for listening.It really does mean a lot that you are here at the end of the show and you made it all the way. I truly and deeply appreciate it. Until next week. I'm Dave Jackson. I help podcasters. It's what I do. And class is dismissed.Please share it with a friend.

Madame Strangeways00:39:16

If you like the show.

Dave Jackson00:39:17

Pretty, pretty please share it with a friend right now.

JR Sparrow00:39:22

Thank you so much for having me on. Dave. Real quick. I want to give you the greatest flowers on earth. You are a living legend. I've been told I'm a living legend, but when I'm near you.Funny thing is I had to compete against you at Podfest. They put me up against you, you know, a Hall of famer, and I had to do my presentation against you. Mark Savant and what's the kid's name?Stephen Rubbles. The Riverside guy?

Marc Maron00:39:53

Yeah.

Dave Jackson00:39:54

Yeah.

Marc Maron00:39:54

That's always.

JR Sparrow00:39:55

Why would you do this?

Dave Jackson00:39:56

That's always rough when you're at an event and you're like, wait, I'm up against, you know, Lou Mongello and a bunch of other people. And you're like, oh man, you know, Lou Mongello, Tom Webster and James Kridlin. You're like, okay, I'm going to talk to nobody that day.

Marc Maron00:40:11

So.

Dave Jackson00:40:11

Well, thank you for the kind words. And I'll have links to everybody's show out in the show notes@schoolofpodcasting.com 10:55 I'm going to guess I don't think I've got that many.I should know this ahead of time. 10:44, You. I'm sorry, you've overbid.

The SOP Ladies00:40:34

Yeah,.