From Facts to Feelings: The Secret Sauce of Engaging Podcasts
Key Takeaways
- Audiences connect to emotion before information, making emotional resonance the secret to building truly engaging podcasts.
- Nostalgia is a powerful tool to evoke shared feelings, but it should be used as a bridge to the present rather than a place to live.
- Personal stories and vulnerability help your show stand out in crowded niches, especially in the age of AI where source material can be identical.
- When using personal vulnerability, ensure you share only what you are genuinely comfortable with and respect the boundaries of other people's stories.
- Great storytelling follows a clear structure: setting the scene with specifics, naming the feeling, describing the struggle, and ending with a practical takeaway for the listener.
If you look at movies that you love, and you think about them, and you remember how they made you feel. Today we talk about three things you can have in your tool belt to use in your show to not just have something to listen to, but to have content that moves your audience. We also answer the question what do Sportcasters, Movie Reviewers, and Christians all have in common?
Pull Some Emotion Into Your Show
Most podcasters focus on information—tips, tactics, and how‑tos. But your audience doesn’t connect to information first; they connect to emotion first.
Three Tools To Boost Connection
- Nostalgia
- Storytelling
- Vulnerability
As the old saying goes, "with great power comes great responsibility," so how do we use these ingredients in our show without sounding like we starting the sympathy engine just to grab attention?
What Do Christians, Movie Reviewer, and Sportscasters all have in common?
They are all working with the same source material. The same bible (more or less), the same movies, the same games. In this episode we talk about how to make your show stand out?
The Best Book on StoryTelling
I've read MANY books on storytelling, but Storyworthy by Matthew Dicks is the best - period. The audiobook is so good you will want to listen with a pad and pencil to take notes (or if you're loving in 2026, take notes on your phone).
Mentioned in this episode:
Live Appearances
I love to meet people when I'm on the road. I'm going to be at Empowered Podcasting Conference in Charlotte NC Podcast Movement in NYC Podindy in Indianapolis In. For more information and links, go to schoolofpodcasting.com/where To have me speak at your event, reach out at schoolofpodcasting.com/contacnt
Question of the Month: The Smallest Amount of Downloads
We all want a bigger audience. We all put a lot of work into our shows. With this in mind, what is the smallest amount of downloads you would do the show for? If it drops below a number would you stop, or put effort into finding out why? Does the size of your audience matter? Go to schoolofpodcasting.com/question by August 28th (and don't forget to say a little bit about your show and your website address so I can link to it in the notes)
Take Live Classes at the School of Podcasting
Podcasting in Six Weeks is BACK! (and this time it's free!) We are continuing to experiment with marketing, and we had so much fun helping people launch their show that we are going it again (and dropped the fee). If you don't have a show but want to start one this is THE place to get going in the right direction. Go to www.schoolofpodcasting.com/sixweeks
Growing Your Podcast Live Course
For members of the School of Podcasting we are all banding together to go through the steps of growing your show (so sign up now!). This will including feedback and strategies to get your show growing faster. You will write down your typical downloads before you start, and compare it to the final numbers. Use the coupon code listener when singing up to become a member and receive a discount. These live classes start August 19th. Please let me know if you have any questions at schoolofpodcasting.com/contact
Frequently Asked Questions
How do I make my podcast more engaging?
To make your podcast more engaging, move beyond simple tips and tactics by incorporating emotional tools like nostalgia, personal storytelling, and vulnerability to truly connect with your audience.
Why is nostalgia effective in podcasting?
Nostalgia evokes deep shared feelings rather than just memories, which helps lock listeners in and disarm their resistance when discussing new or complex ideas.
What is the best book on storytelling for podcasters?
Dave Jackson recommends 'Storyworthy' by Matthew Dicks as the absolute best book for learning how to structure and tell compelling stories.
How can I stand out in a crowded podcast niche?
Even if others are covering the exact same source material or topics, your unique personal stories, struggles, and emotional perspectives are your ultimate differentiators.
00:00 - Untitled
00:00 - Emotion Over Information
00:13 - Opening
01:05 - Nostalgia
03:11 - Nostalgia in Podcasting
04:56 - Analogies the Cousin of Nostalgia
06:39 - Trying to Stay Relevant
07:20 - Nostalgia is Powerful If...
08:08 - Nostalgia Danger Zone
13:14 - Nostalgia Works Best When...
14:06 - Using Stories to Stand Out
17:51 - Vulnerability
21:05 - Keep This in Mind
23:35 - Stories
24:08 - Best Story Telling Book
25:45 - How did you get through it
26:19 - Don't Start the Sympathy Engine
26:46 - Hope BLVD The Exception
29:42 - Tucking Your Kids in
30:52 - How to Tell if It's Working
31:22 - Join the School of Podcasting
31:55 - When it helps you make a point
33:21 - If you're married...
34:13 - Join the School of Podcasting
Speaker A
In this episode, we're going to look at three powerful tools to move your audience.
Speaker A
Nostalgia, story, and vulnerability, and how not to overdo any of them.
Speaker A
Wow, that's deep, man.
Speaker A
Hit it, ladies.
Speaker A
The School of Podcasting with Dave Jackson.
Speaker A
Podcasting since 2005, I am your award winning hall of fame podcast coach, Dave Jackson, thanking you so much for tuning in.
Speaker A
If you're new to the show, this is where I help you plan, launch, and grow your podcast.
Speaker A
And today we're going to be talking about making great content, and that is what grows your audience.
Speaker A
Nobody, you know, shares a show that they didn't listen to the whole thing.
Speaker A
My website is schoolofpodcasting.com and if you go over and check that out, I'm using PodPage, which is a great tool.
Speaker A
We make beautiful websites for podcasters who don't want to learn how to code.
Speaker A
Find the website at schoolofpodcasting.com, find podpage@podpage.com and so today, we're not just talking about content, we're talking about content that moves you.
Speaker A
And so the first one I want to talk about is nostalgia.
Speaker A
Now, can we stop for a second and peel back the curtain?
Speaker A
I'm going to use a personal story to explain how nostalgia is very powerful.
Speaker A
And later, I will be talking about stories.
Speaker A
So I am drinking my own Kool Aid here.
Speaker A
All right, now let's pretend we're just listening to the show.
Speaker A
But when I was married, I've been married twice, and I've been, unfortunately, divorced twice.
Speaker A
And my second wife and I were married for close to eight years.
Speaker A
We were in counseling for six.
Speaker A
Yes, it was.
Speaker A
We gave it the old college try, and we went through somewhere between six to eight counselors.
Speaker A
And every time we would go in the very first session, they would sit down and they'd be like, hey, it's really great that you're both here.
Speaker A
Let's start off.
Speaker A
Dave, why don't you go first.
Speaker A
Tell us about your first date.
Speaker A
What were you thinking when you first saw your.
Speaker A
You're my spouse.
Speaker A
And I remembered it.
Speaker A
She wore a blue skirt and a pink sweater, and she was gorgeous.
Speaker A
And I was like, jackpot.
Speaker A
Well, that was nostalgia.
Speaker A
Remember when and what they're trying to do or what the counselor was trying to do was remember that feeling of hubba hubba and try to restore and remember those days when you actually liked your spouse.
Speaker A
In fact, I remember they would say that you didn't marry Hitler.
Speaker A
You used to like this guy.
Speaker A
And so they were using nostalgia to bring up emotions.
Speaker A
So that's an example of that.
Speaker A
Counselors do this because nostalgia evokes feelings.
Speaker A
Not just memories, but feelings are what lock people in.
Speaker A
So you can use the hey, remember when?
Speaker A
To evoke feelings in your audience.
Speaker A
And now, how does this work, Dave, with podcasting?
Speaker A
Well, I'll give you an example.
Speaker A
Someone reached out to me once.
Speaker A
He said, man, I love your show, but I'm just going to give you a tip.
Speaker A
And for the record, I'm always open to feedback.
Speaker A
I have so many layers of skin, I'm always open schoolofpodcasting.com contact.
Speaker A
And he said, you know, you could probably get a bigger audience if you kind of.
Speaker A
Kind of cut down on the Fonzie references.
Speaker A
And so if you are under probably 30, you're like, what's a Fonzie?
Speaker A
Is that some sort of toy?
Speaker A
But it's a character on a TV show that was very popular called Happy Days.
Speaker A
The actor was Henry Winkler, who I absolutely adore.
Speaker A
And yes, back in the day, I had a Fonzie poster on the back of my closet.
Speaker A
He was.
Speaker A
I mean, he had.
Speaker A
There was like, hysteria.
Speaker A
He would get mobbed, that kind of popularity.
Speaker A
And so that is something that, for me, it's just me being me.
Speaker A
And if you don't know who Fonzie is, you might be a little lost.
Speaker A
But if you're over the age, probably 40, you probably know who Fonzie is.
Speaker A
Maybe 50, I don't know.
Speaker A
But keep that in mind, that when people hear Fonzie, they're like, oh, I remember that.
Speaker A
And then you remember how great Happy was until, of course, Fonzie jumped the shark.
Speaker A
And, you know, I remember I have talked to people, and if I work with software, and I'm like, man, we need to have Fonzie come in and hit the jukebox.
Speaker A
Now, again, you're under 40.
Speaker A
You probably don't know what that means.
Speaker A
If you're above 40 or 50, you're smiling because you remember when Fonzie would come in and hit the jukebox.
Speaker A
When I have someone that is not quite understanding what podcasting is.
Speaker A
Here again, I tried to build a bridge from something they understood to now.
Speaker A
Basically, I'm building a bridge from back then to now.
Speaker A
And this isn't really nostalgia, but it can be because it disarms people, because you have people, this is me talking as a teacher, that are deathly afraid of technology.
Speaker A
And so when they go, I don't understand how this podcasting thing, I don't get it.
Speaker A
I can't do It.
Speaker A
And I will say, do you remember radio?
Speaker A
And they will go, yeah.
Speaker A
And I go, my brother, I remember radio.
Speaker A
My brother had a transistor radio that was about the size of your hand.
Speaker A
It had the audio quality of frying bacon underwater.
Speaker A
And yet I could hear that we had bunk beds and he would have it under his pillow.
Speaker A
And I just remember radio.
Speaker A
And I'm like, well, here's the deal.
Speaker A
It's kind of like radio for the Internet, only instead of a dj, it's you in a spare bedroom.
Speaker A
And instead of a radio station, it's your media host.
Speaker A
And instead of a signal like 97.5, it's your RSS feed.
Speaker A
And slowly I disarm their fear of technology because I'm connecting it to something that they feel safe with.
Speaker A
So that, again, is a minor use of technology, but that's just good old.
Speaker A
I've had people say, dave, you're the analogy king.
Speaker A
But that's just something I've always used.
Speaker A
It does not work when you're married.
Speaker A
I remember once I was having one of our many arguments with my ex wife number two, and I said, well, it's kind of like.
Speaker A
And she went, no, no, just tell me what it is.
Speaker A
Don't tell me what it's like.
Speaker A
So, you know, Fonzie was so popular where today I might.
Speaker A
If I want to bring up something really popular, I might bring up, I don't know, K pop.
Speaker A
Right.
Speaker A
Because the.
Speaker A
The youngins, from what I understand, are all about the K pop.
Speaker A
So the nostalgia kind of signals your area.
Speaker A
And if you can, I try to keep up with what the kids are doing, so I can somewhat connect with everyone.
Speaker A
But that, again, sometimes you end up sounding like the old white guy trying to sound cool.
Speaker A
So that sometimes doesn't work.
Speaker A
But trends, if you can keep up with them, it can help you stop sounding like you're living in the past.
Speaker A
And that's one of the things that we want to keep in mind when it comes to nostalgia.
Speaker A
It is powerful if it evokes shared emotion.
Speaker A
It's powerful if you don't live there.
Speaker A
So if you're like, I was so much better back in 1972, I want to hear more fog hat.
Speaker A
Right.
Speaker A
That's.
Speaker A
No, you can't live there.
Speaker A
But it's nice to go back, grab the feelings and bring them into the present.
Speaker A
You connect that.
Speaker A
Remember when to here's what this means for you today.
Speaker A
That's the key.
Speaker A
What's the takeaway?
Speaker A
Because it's nice to go back there.
Speaker A
But what is that.
Speaker A
That's great, Grandpa.
Speaker A
But I don't care about, you know, the summer of 67.
Speaker A
What does this have to do with today?
Speaker A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A
And before I move off nostalgia again, I want to point this out.
Speaker A
Not everybody, if you live there, it kind of can bum people out because they're like, oh, I do wish it was like 1974, 1992, you know, 2003 was the best, whatever.
Speaker A
And you don't want people feeling bummed.
Speaker A
And not everybody wants to live in the past.
Speaker A
In some cases, you know, it can bum them out.
Speaker A
So keep that in mind.
Speaker A
And some people are get tired of it.
Speaker A
Like I said, my ex wife had had enough analogies.
Speaker A
So that's a danger zone.
Speaker A
And then the other thing you have to be careful with is when you talk nostalgia, and especially if it's from someone's childhood, you have to be very careful because you are dealing with sacred cows is what people call these.
Speaker A
So, for example, one of the tortures I was put through as a child is my father and my sister would make me watch a show called Hee Haw.
Speaker A
Ugh.
Speaker A
And it was followed by Star Trek.
Speaker A
Ugh.
Speaker A
Not a fan.
Speaker A
Because I had to watch it.
Speaker A
There were no more TVs in the house back then.
Speaker A
And so if I make fun of Star Trek, some guy's gonna meet me at, I don't know, podcast movement and come up and say, live long and prosper, and then punch me in the face.
Speaker A
So there's that.
Speaker A
I remember the song Purple Haze by Jimi Hendrix.
Speaker A
Nobody ever covered that song.
Speaker A
When?
Speaker A
Why?
Speaker A
Because you're gonna immediately compare yourself to Jimi Hendrix, and nobody wanted to do that.
Speaker A
It's kind of a sacred cow.
Speaker A
And I remember Ozzy Osbourne did a cover of that, which is actually a really good cover.
Speaker A
It was for some sort of tribute album.
Speaker A
And at the end, just for the record, guitar players, Zakk Wylde loses his mind at the end of that.
Speaker A
My sister's boyfriend, who we affectionately, and this is affectionately, we call him Comic Book Frank.
Speaker A
This guy is really into.
Speaker A
And I'm sorry if I offended you, graphic novels.
Speaker A
But he's a guy that when he goes and sees a Marvel film, he'll be like, well, it would have been good.
Speaker A
But so and so from this other universe and blah, blah, blah.
Speaker A
And so here again, you're messing with his childhood.
Speaker A
He grew up reading those books.
Speaker A
We could.
Speaker A
I don't want to get political, but Snow White is something that you can get nostalgia for because it's very old.
Speaker A
It's the very first or one of the very first animated full motion picture kind of things.
Speaker A
Back in motion pictures there kitties.
Speaker A
And of course, they changed the story of that, and that movie flopped like nobody's business.
Speaker A
And then the other thing, if you go remember the day for that to really evoke emotions, I'm not really talking about last week.
Speaker A
And so Disney, and I'll take a baby tangent here, the movie industry is worried sick to make anything remotely offensive.
Speaker A
And all they keep doing is remaking the old movie.
Speaker A
Why?
Speaker A
Because they're counting on the nostalgia.
Speaker A
They're like, oh, I love that movie as a kid.
Speaker A
A key point here is the movie Moana, which was this, you know, really popular animated cartoon.
Speaker A
And they redid it, you know, a live action almost shot for shot.
Speaker A
That movie's not even 10 years old.
Speaker A
It might be 10 years old, but not a lot of people going, remember when?
Speaker A
And like, well, no.
Speaker A
And if I wanted to see that movie exactly like it is, I would kind of just go watch the movie.
Speaker A
So you're not going to get a lot of remember when if it's not hard to remember because, well, it was.
Speaker A
It was just like two years ago.
Speaker A
So keep that in mind.
Speaker A
You can also, again, talk about sacred cows.
Speaker A
I watched a video on YouTube and I didn't know they were doing this, but Netflix.
Speaker A
I grew up, my mom's favorite movie was Gone with the Wind.
Speaker A
So when I was a wee lad, she took me.
Speaker A
By the way, this is another personal story.
Speaker A
My mom took me to a theater, a big one, in downtown Akron, to watch Gone with the Wind.
Speaker A
And why?
Speaker A
Because it had a giant screen, had a great sound system.
Speaker A
This is, you know, back in the 70s.
Speaker A
And she said, I want you to see the burning of Atlanta on a big screen.
Speaker A
It's a big scene in that movie.
Speaker A
Now, that movie is about the Civil War.
Speaker A
And if you don't remember history, kids, that was when the north and south fought.
Speaker A
And one of the issues was slavery.
Speaker A
So there were slaves in that movie.
Speaker A
And Netflix, if you go to look at it on Netflix, it's like, oh, by the way, this is a racist movie.
Speaker A
And there are people.
Speaker A
And I saw this person online that said, look, I'm black.
Speaker A
I grew up with that movie.
Speaker A
I had Gone with the Wind dolls.
Speaker A
And when you start, you know, picking on my sacred cow, she's like, this is ridiculous.
Speaker A
So don't mock or casually rewrite what people see as their childhood or their identity.
Speaker A
You know, nostalgia works best, number one, when you respect the original or you use it as a bridge Not a punching bag.
Speaker A
And you actually give enough distance for it to be nostalgia.
Speaker A
So if you're going to mess with someone's childhood, you better do it with a lot of respect or not at all.
Speaker A
And I usually don't deep dive into nostalgia a lot.
Speaker A
Just to mention something to make a point.
Speaker A
And that's the other thing.
Speaker A
The personal stories I'm making here are.
Speaker A
Are often to make a point I'm just not throwing in.
Speaker A
Let me tell you about my cat and how he ruined my couch.
Speaker A
Well, Dave, what does that have to do with what we're talking about?
Speaker A
No, these are tools to help make a point.
Speaker A
And it's not just making a point.
Speaker A
It's a point that helps your audience feel something.
Speaker A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A
Oh, before we move on, I gotta play the warning.
Speaker A
Sorry about this.
Speaker A
Hang on.
Speaker A
You guessed it.
Speaker A
Invisible Sky Buddy alert.
Speaker A
Invisible Sky Buddy alert.
Speaker A
Beware.
Speaker A
One of the things that inspired this episode is I hear so much about AI and the one thing that AI doesn't have is the thing that I want to talk about, and that is stories.
Speaker A
Your personal stories.
Speaker A
I've used a couple here today.
Speaker A
And the reason I'm bringing up the Invisible Sky Buddy.
Speaker A
And this doesn't just go for any kind of religious podcast.
Speaker A
It could go for any, you know, this could be to the two guys talking movies kind of thing.
Speaker A
And that is, how do I make my show different?
Speaker A
Because if you think about it, with Christians, they're all using the Bible.
Speaker A
Now, granted, there's like 57 million versions.
Speaker A
There's the NIV, the ESV, the XBK, the King James version 12, the super cool, super hip Bible, whatever it is.
Speaker A
And with movies, like, if you have three podcasts about movies and you're all talking about the Odyssey, you know, it's the same source material.
Speaker A
So how are you going to stand out?
Speaker A
What makes the difference?
Speaker A
And that is a personal story.
Speaker A
I was working with someone this week, a client, and he was talking, there's a story in the Bible about Abram.
Speaker A
And lot and lot kind of goes off and does he makes a bad choice.
Speaker A
And he mentioned how this had to be kind of disappointing to Abram.
Speaker A
And I was like, that would be a great place to put in a personal story about when you were disappointed about something or even just ask the audience, have you ever felt disappointed?
Speaker A
Can you think of a time when you were disappointed?
Speaker A
Have them do the nostalgia in their head.
Speaker A
You don't always have to give that to them, but it's a way to get the emotions into your podcast.
Speaker A
And.
Speaker A
And so in this case, he just kind of mentioned it.
Speaker A
And if you think about it, in any crowded niche, doesn't matter if it's religious, movies, whatever, somebody else is doing a podcast like yours, especially in the age of AI, your best differentiator isn't what you cover.
Speaker A
It's the stories and emotions you're willing to share around it.
Speaker A
And we're going to get into sharing and oversharing right after this.
Speaker A
The school of podcasting.
Speaker A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A
Vulnerability is when.
Speaker A
For me, it's when you talk about something that you normally wouldn't talk about.
Speaker A
When you meet someone for the first time, it's kind of a third date, thinking deep kind of thing.
Speaker A
And I remember when I was listening to Howard Stern interview Stephen Colbert, he had just gotten the Stephen Colbert show.
Speaker A
And.
Speaker A
And what was interesting is I thought Howard was the first person that shared a vulnerable story.
Speaker A
He asked a very deep question, and what had happened, if you aren't aware of this, Stephen Colbert lost his father and his two brothers in a plane crash.
Speaker A
And so Howard was talking about that subject and how his relationship evolved with his mom.
Speaker A
And Stephen said this.
Speaker A
Well, yeah, we used to.
Speaker A
I used to joke, or mom.
Speaker A
And I used to joke that I raised my mom right, you know, because at a certain point, she.
Speaker A
It changed her completely.
Speaker A
And, of course, it changed me completely.
Speaker A
And if you want your guest to share a vulnerable story, sometimes you have to share yours first to kind of go, look, I'm willing to put my heart out here on the table.
Speaker A
And I thought that Howard had shared his story first.
Speaker A
And listening back to this clip, he.
Speaker A
It was actually Howard asked a very deep question, and Stephen shared his first and then asked Howard, why did you ask the question?
Speaker A
Check out this story.
Speaker B
Is it difficult for you to be around a crying woman now because of your mother?
Speaker A
Wow, that's deep, man.
Speaker B
Well, seriously.
Speaker A
Yeah, deep, Howard.
Speaker A
You're getting deep.
Speaker A
No, seriously, That's a very deep question, Howard.
Speaker B
But when women are difficult, because your mom had to be difficult.
Speaker B
She was going through a crisis.
Speaker A
Not difficult, but, you know, upset.
Speaker A
I think there's no doubt.
Speaker A
I do what I do because I wanted to make her happy.
Speaker B
You're used to cheering up a woman?
Speaker B
Yes.
Speaker B
Yeah.
Speaker A
So that's probably not a conversation that he has with a lot of people.
Speaker A
And so he then now, feeling kind of intimate with Howard, asked him a question.
Speaker A
Hold on.
Speaker B
Wait a second.
Speaker A
How do you know to ask that question?
Speaker B
Because I spent many years cheering up your mother as well.
Speaker B
I didn't want to say this no, no.
Speaker B
What happened?
Speaker B
My mother lost her mother when she was 9.
Speaker B
And my mother became very depressed when her sister died.
Speaker B
And I spent a lot of years trying to cheer up my mother.
Speaker B
And I became quite proficient at making her laugh and doing impressions and doing impressions of all the people in the neighborhood.
Speaker B
It made her feel so I wonder.
Speaker B
And even to this day, when I see a woman in distress, I feel like I have to jump in and solve her problem.
Speaker A
That's not a bad impulse, though.
Speaker B
Well, it certainly makes for a career.
Speaker A
And so Howard matched Steven's innomisky level.
Speaker A
And you then kind of earn deeper answers by going there himself because Howard shared.
Speaker A
You know, Stephen might be willing to then share again.
Speaker A
The other thing that Howard should think about here.
Speaker A
And this is where we're going to get into sometimes the downside of this is what Howard is talking about.
Speaker A
His mom was a Holocaust survivor, and maybe mom doesn't want that on the radio.
Speaker A
And speaking of that, these are some things you want to think about when it comes to being vulnerable.
Speaker A
And number one, only share what you are genuinely comfortable sharing.
Speaker A
And some people will peel back everything.
Speaker A
I'm an open book.
Speaker A
That's up to you.
Speaker A
But be very cautious with other people's stories.
Speaker A
Like I said, maybe Howard's mom didn't want that on the radio.
Speaker A
And the other thing you want to do, and this reminds me, I watched Pete Davidson show.
Speaker A
I watched two episodes of his Giant Quotation Marks podcast because it's not a podcast on Netflix.
Speaker A
And so I'm a big Dennis Leary fan.
Speaker A
So I watched that episode.
Speaker A
And if you didn't know, Pete Davidson's dad was a firefighter who died on 911 in New York City.
Speaker A
And they ended up talking about his dad because Dennis Leary did a show all about firefighters.
Speaker A
And then later he was talking with the son of James Gandolfini, better known as Tony Soprano.
Speaker A
And so once again, because James, unfortunately, is dead.
Speaker A
And so you had two guys who have lost their father, and.
Speaker A
And I was kind of like, it didn't jump into my head.
Speaker A
But being that I'd only randomly picked two episodes and both of them felt like, well, somewhere we're going to talk about Pete's dad.
Speaker A
And I was like, are.
Speaker A
Are they.
Speaker A
Are they using this kind of thing?
Speaker A
It's kind of weird.
Speaker A
It should feel like a service when you're being vulnerable to the listener, not a permanent, I don't know, identity, like, hi, I'm Dave, you know, blah, blah, blah, or you don't want it to be.
Speaker A
I guess you Would call it a sympathy engine.
Speaker A
Oh, we need some.
Speaker A
We need some emotions here.
Speaker A
Somebody crank up the sympathy engine.
Speaker A
That's not what we're looking for either.
Speaker A
It has to be honest.
Speaker A
And that's really, again, I think, why people appreciate it, because when you're sharing things you don't normally share, it's.
Speaker A
It's.
Speaker A
You're being vulnerable.
Speaker A
And it's appreciated because most people appreciate honesty.
Speaker A
And it can then make them feel like, wow, this person's really trusting me with this knowledge.
Speaker A
And it then makes them trust you.
Speaker A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A
And so stories can, again, help you set apart your show from others.
Speaker A
Uh, John C. Dvorak unfortunately passed away last month, and there were 12 hours.
Speaker A
12 Hours of people sending in clips saying, we're gonna miss you, John.
Speaker A
And they put those out as episodes, and they all said the same thing.
Speaker A
I loved his stories.
Speaker A
They're talking about the news.
Speaker A
And then you would find out, John would be like, well, that's back when I was a pollution inspector.
Speaker A
And you're like, wait, what?
Speaker A
You are polluted.
Speaker A
So stories kind of come into play again.
Speaker A
I will recommend this book, Story Worthy by Matthew Dix.
Speaker A
If you have it and haven't read it, shame on you.
Speaker A
That thing is gold.
Speaker A
And it will teach you not that stories are good.
Speaker A
We all know that it will teach you how to tell a story.
Speaker A
Now, if we want to boil this down to, you know, three easy steps or five easy steps, number one, Set the scene with specifics.
Speaker A
So usually I try to set it up where I'm moving in a way.
Speaker A
So I'm getting out of my car, and I look up and I see this gorgeous brunette in a blue skirt and a pink sweater.
Speaker A
And little did I know that that date was going to end six hours later.
Speaker A
Right?
Speaker A
It's moving.
Speaker A
You see me, you see the brunette, you see the blue skirt, right?
Speaker A
And then name the feeling.
Speaker A
Well, in my case, my feeling was hubba, hubba.
Speaker A
Holy cow.
Speaker A
I was grateful that I got to spend time with this amazing woman and then describe your struggle.
Speaker A
And so this is where something.
Speaker A
You know, here's what I was wrestling with or what happened here.
Speaker A
Because a story is about transformation.
Speaker A
That's one of the things that Matthew teaches.
Speaker A
It's like, hey, I was here, and I ended up way over here after going through whatever this struggle is.
Speaker A
So Luke Skywalker, you know, when he was working with Yoda, you know, he didn't think.
Speaker A
He didn't have the confidence.
Speaker A
He didn't know how to use the force.
Speaker A
And then he figured it Out.
Speaker A
That's what he wrestled with.
Speaker A
And then, you know, he saved the day and got the girl.
Speaker A
So explain how you got through it.
Speaker A
This is what listeners really want, because you've made them identify with you.
Speaker A
Now tell them how you got through it, because they want to get through it, too.
Speaker A
And then end with the takeaway.
Speaker A
Tie it directly back to the listener.
Speaker A
Because when you point out that you understand the listener situation, they go, oh, man, she gets me.
Speaker A
That guy knows exactly what he's talking about because he knows where I am now.
Speaker A
I am very nervous about talking about, you know, there's authenticity, right?
Speaker A
That's always.
Speaker A
You always want to be authentic.
Speaker A
But I worry about people being vulnerable for the sake of being vulnerable, because people are moved by honesty.
Speaker A
But every episode doesn't have to have some sort of shocking confession.
Speaker A
Now, as always, it depends.
Speaker A
I'll give you an example.
Speaker A
A new member of the school of podcasting just launched her show.
Speaker A
I think she's on episode five, Hope Boulevard.
Speaker A
HopeBlvd.org is where you can find Jerry Carlson, who was paralyzed for a year and could not move.
Speaker A
And so her story has lots of things making you go, wait, how did you get through that?
Speaker A
And some of it is like, wait, they did what you were taking?
Speaker A
What kind of drugs?
Speaker A
And so her story is the story.
Speaker A
Like, she's not mixing in a story.
Speaker A
Her story is the content.
Speaker A
So, as always, there are exceptions to the rule if your story is what's going to motivate people.
Speaker A
So I'll put links to that in the show notes.
Speaker A
And one of my favorite parts of her story so far is she was talking about, you know, she's in a hospital bed.
Speaker A
She can kind of move her neck, and that's about it.
Speaker A
And her husband comes in and gives her a big hug.
Speaker A
That really triggered the theater of the mind.
Speaker A
And can you not connect with really needing a hug and getting one?
Speaker A
That's an amazing emotion.
Speaker A
The school of podcasting.
Speaker A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A
When you talk your children in at night, they don't say, hey, mommy, hey, daddy, will you tell me a statistic?
Speaker A
No, they say, tell me a story.
Speaker A
And so people don't connect to information first.
Speaker A
They connect to emotion first.
Speaker A
And so nostalgia, when you sparingly, you know, tied to today, again, with respect, can be very powerful.
Speaker A
Stories with specific details and feelings and how you got through it.
Speaker A
Really powerful.
Speaker A
Vulnerability when honest and not manufactured when it's appropriate.
Speaker A
And again, never weaponized.
Speaker A
I guess you could say for clicks, you're not using it.
Speaker A
Like, ooh, wait a minute, we're going to do this.
Speaker A
This will go viral.
Speaker A
No, that's not what we're really looking for.
Speaker A
Why does this matter?
Speaker A
Why would we want to use these things?
Speaker A
Because if you do this, you don't just get listeners, you move them.
Speaker A
And that's what we want.
Speaker A
At the school of podcasting, we have listener parties.
Speaker A
We'll be talking with Glenn the geek from Horse Radio Network on how he has a focus group set up in the future, but we have listener parties.
Speaker A
And what's great about them is you get to watch us listen to your show.
Speaker A
And so you can see when we're supposed to laugh or cry or think or whatever.
Speaker A
And if we're not laughing when we're supposed to laugh, you might want to tweak that.
Speaker A
And so you can find me out@schoolofpodcasting.com use the coupon code listener when you sign up for either a monthly, quarterly, or yearly subscription.
Speaker A
And of course, when you go out to schoolofpodcasting.com that is built on PodPage.
Speaker A
And if you want to try PodPage, just go over to podpage.com preview, put in your feed or the name of your show, and you can start using PodPage for free for 14 days.
Speaker A
And I do, before we get out of here, want to again say, I hope you hear my heart on this.
Speaker A
I'm not advocating that you crank up the sympathy engine every single episode.
Speaker A
There are times for the sympathy engine, but not every episode.
Speaker A
Keep that in mind.
Speaker A
I hope you get that.
Speaker A
I don't want to come across, as Dave says, we have to just spill our guts in every episode.
Speaker A
No, no.
Speaker A
But you can share stories that help make a point.
Speaker A
That's the other point I should probably throw in here.
Speaker A
Why did I talk about marriage counseling today?
Speaker A
Because we're talking about nostalgia, and that counselor used nostalgia, and I explained how that actually worked, and maybe you should try it.
Speaker A
So hence, there's always that.
Speaker A
Here's what it is.
Speaker A
Here's the struggle.
Speaker A
Here's how it worked.
Speaker A
Because again, we started marriage counseling six months into being married, and we lasted eight years going to counselor and counselor.
Speaker A
So it did kind of work a little bit until it didn't.
Speaker A
Because after about the seventh counselor, and they're like, tell us about your first date.
Speaker A
You're kind of like, yeah, we tried.
Speaker A
That didn't work.
Speaker A
Thanks.
Speaker A
Anyway, so I just hope you hear my heart on that.
Speaker A
I'm not saying go out and just start spilling your guts, but when you can make a point, whatever that point is, with a personal story.
Speaker A
AI can't do that.
Speaker A
And it draws the audience closer.
Speaker A
And it can actually not just again, make them hear you, but you can actually move your audience.
Speaker A
I am going to throw in a complete tangent here, and that is, as someone who went through a lot of marriage counseling, I highly recommend it.
Speaker A
And you can say, dave, but it didn't work.
Speaker A
You ended up getting divorced.
Speaker A
I'm just here to say I learned a lot of stuff in counseling that I still use today, and I know about myself and I know myself better.
Speaker A
And so if you are having struggles in your marriage, I strongly recommend you get some counseling.
Speaker A
Because in the same way, today we talked about different tools you can use in your episode.
Speaker A
Counseling can give you the tools of communication that can lead to a better marriage.
Speaker A
And I'm here to tell you, if you think counseling is expensive, wait till you pay for a divorce or two.
Speaker A
So I'm Dave Jackson.
Speaker A
I help podcasters.
Speaker A
It's what I do.
Speaker A
It's what I love to do.
Speaker A
The website schoolofpodcasting.com that thanks so much.
Speaker A
Until next week.
Speaker A
Take care.
Speaker A
God bless.
Speaker A
Class is dismissed.
Speaker A
If you like the show, please share it with a friend.
Speaker A
If you like the show, pretty, pretty please share it with a friend right now.
Speaker A
And so when we think about trying to get information, oh, that's a horrible way to start.
Speaker A
So if you think about it, if you're talking or tucking a little one in for their at bedtime, boy, that was awful.
Speaker A
People don't connect to information first.
Speaker A
They connect to emotion first.
Speaker A
And in this episode, we're going to look at three powerful tools.
Speaker A
Easy for me to say.
